Hello everyone,
I am looking for enthusiastic individuals for collaboration to build a Stirling engine with a solar dish to produce 0.5 to 1 kw electricity.
0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
I have the same logistical questions as before. Except one"for a school project"
Heat source: Solar dish
Where? It can be easy or difficult to "collaborate" depending on your location.
When? If this is for a school project, there would presumably be some due date.
How? You will pay for parts and time? Having parts manufactured for a one-off engine, particularly with 1kw electrical power output could be prohibitively expensive, unless you have unlimited funds of some sort.
How much "help" exactly are you looking for? If you, as stated, will pay for parts and labor, what is your role, other than to provide funding? Do you have any sort of engine design in mind at all? Thermoacoustic? Thermal lag?
Same questions.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
Something like this, from a different US company, just to put things in perspective:
https://youtu.be/EahfGfDdgNY
Took about $100 million in funding to develop, a team of NASA scientists, and an estimated $30,000 per unit to produce, in the 1kw range. (Later increased to 3kw, with an additional $50 million)
The company went bankrupt, apparently, in the end.
One of these can be purchased, relatively cheap, but does not advertise any actual power output.
https://www.3bscientific.com/us/sun-run ... 10765.html?
Engines with that kind of power generally require charging with helium, which can be difficult to get, with the current shortage, as I'm finding out.
Unpressurized, the engine would likely be very big and heavy. This one for example is almost 0.5 kw:
https://youtu.be/Ge3cerSVEI0
https://youtu.be/EahfGfDdgNY
Took about $100 million in funding to develop, a team of NASA scientists, and an estimated $30,000 per unit to produce, in the 1kw range. (Later increased to 3kw, with an additional $50 million)
The company went bankrupt, apparently, in the end.
One of these can be purchased, relatively cheap, but does not advertise any actual power output.
https://www.3bscientific.com/us/sun-run ... 10765.html?
Engines with that kind of power generally require charging with helium, which can be difficult to get, with the current shortage, as I'm finding out.
Unpressurized, the engine would likely be very big and heavy. This one for example is almost 0.5 kw:
https://youtu.be/Ge3cerSVEI0
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
I received your PM, unless there is some compelling reason to do otherwise, my preference is to keep my conversations on these message boards public.
Getting help with a "school project", does not necessitate PM's or email exchanges. Frankly, building a 1kw solar tracking dish Stirling engine "something like INFINIA" does not sound like a plausible school assignment.
When I have the engine dismantled, if ever, I may have a local machinist give an estimate on making some of the parts.
My own machine shop is being set up, mostly for making smaller model engines, for now, though there is room for more equipment
I missed a good opportunity recently as all the equipment from a local machine shop that went out of business got auctioned off, but I did not know about the auction. Most of the machines went to a scrap metal dealer and unfortunately, were destroyed in the process of removal from the building. What a shame.
A larger size metal lathe and milling machine, larger than what I have, would probably be needed for a bigger power producing engine, and would probably save money over commissioning a machine shop to do all the work.
Anyway, that is the sort of thing I've been working on, and will continue to work on, but I was not on any particular time schedule.
But, maybe you are Bill Gates, or Donald Trump's nephew in a private school for rich kids or some such, so..
When is your school project due to be handed in?
Getting help with a "school project", does not necessitate PM's or email exchanges. Frankly, building a 1kw solar tracking dish Stirling engine "something like INFINIA" does not sound like a plausible school assignment.
When I have the engine dismantled, if ever, I may have a local machinist give an estimate on making some of the parts.
My own machine shop is being set up, mostly for making smaller model engines, for now, though there is room for more equipment
I missed a good opportunity recently as all the equipment from a local machine shop that went out of business got auctioned off, but I did not know about the auction. Most of the machines went to a scrap metal dealer and unfortunately, were destroyed in the process of removal from the building. What a shame.
A larger size metal lathe and milling machine, larger than what I have, would probably be needed for a bigger power producing engine, and would probably save money over commissioning a machine shop to do all the work.
Anyway, that is the sort of thing I've been working on, and will continue to work on, but I was not on any particular time schedule.
But, maybe you are Bill Gates, or Donald Trump's nephew in a private school for rich kids or some such, so..
When is your school project due to be handed in?
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
Probably something like one of these might be suitable as a magnetic piston for the engine / linear generator,
https://amfmagnets.com/products/samariu ... 0926452886
Apparently the samarium cobalt magnets have a much higher curie temperature than neodymium.
About 750°c
Neodymium magnets, on the other hand can begin to be demagnetized at about the temperature of boiling water.
https://amfmagnets.com/products/samariu ... 0926452886
Apparently the samarium cobalt magnets have a much higher curie temperature than neodymium.
About 750°c
Neodymium magnets, on the other hand can begin to be demagnetized at about the temperature of boiling water.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
Thank you so much Tom for the time and effort you spent to provide all the information and details, and I really appreciate it.
I try to answer all the questions as much as possible.
School project: I donate this device to a school to motivate the students to think out of the box.
Fund: I pay from my pocket.
Timeline: there is no tight schedule or a timeline, it is something I have always wanted to build.
Skills: I am a mechanical engineer, using my friend's workshop and I already have the dish and sun tracker, and many different sizes of alternators, but the only missing part is the Stirling engine in this project that I have never built any. I need help when I am building one so I minimize repeating the same common mistakes.
Collaboration: I do love to hear from as much people here as possible to give their advice and opinions while I am building the engine.
Infinia: yes, they have a wonderful project. There is a Swedish one Azelio as well, and they inspired me.
Bill Gates & Donald Trump: I know both of them very well, but there is one problem, they do not know me.
I try to answer all the questions as much as possible.
School project: I donate this device to a school to motivate the students to think out of the box.
Fund: I pay from my pocket.
Timeline: there is no tight schedule or a timeline, it is something I have always wanted to build.
Skills: I am a mechanical engineer, using my friend's workshop and I already have the dish and sun tracker, and many different sizes of alternators, but the only missing part is the Stirling engine in this project that I have never built any. I need help when I am building one so I minimize repeating the same common mistakes.
Collaboration: I do love to hear from as much people here as possible to give their advice and opinions while I am building the engine.
Infinia: yes, they have a wonderful project. There is a Swedish one Azelio as well, and they inspired me.
Bill Gates & Donald Trump: I know both of them very well, but there is one problem, they do not know me.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
do you just collect the Stirling engines or you have built also please?
if you ever built any then you are the right person for my project and I would love to talk to you in details about my vision.
if you ever built any then you are the right person for my project and I would love to talk to you in details about my vision.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
"Built" is relative I guess. -put together, small models, from kits mostly.
I'm in the process of setting up a workshop, pretty much for building Stirling engines, more or less from scratch, of all sorts, from small models on up:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5408
But I'm just getting started, and progress is slow. We bought the building just a few months before COVID hit and everything shut down, but we are plugging along.
My "engine building", so far has mostly been just modifying bought model engines to experiment with. There are probably several others on the forum better equipped and with more experience
The Infinia engine according to the company, would (once in production), cost something like $30,000, I think, including the dish, but was never produced commercially, that I know of.
I have an idea it could be built for a lot less, and possibly much lighter and, if some of my theories are correct, more efficient, but that remains to be seen.
The Infinia/NASA engine was built to run maintenance free for 30 years in the harshest environments, potentially, even outer space, as well as probably bullet and explosion proof, for use by the military, so, I imagine it is very much over engineered, over priced and much more heavy duty than would be required for ordinary use.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
There is an internet satellite dish, I asked a telecom company and they donated it to this test project, it is around 3-4m diameter.
I can build a smaller size if needed.
I can build a smaller size if needed.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
The Infinia dish, to produce 3000 watts was closer to five meters 15 feet or 4.6 meters (I think) Unless that was the 1000 watt version.
Either way your dish should be big enough to produce at least 500 watts. Of course, that would depend on things like the quality of the reflective surface, and the capabilities of the engine.
The frame may need some reinforcement if it is going to have to hold an engine up in the air.
I don't think you would want to go smaller.
At this point, I'm still not sure the Infinia engine I have will operate, or if I'll be able to get useable power out of it.
I was reading something recently that their early test models had issues with leaking helium and required fairly regular refilling, but that was being tested in a vacuum chamber to simulate conditions in outer space.
But I also noticed some fraying of the electrical cord at the point where it passes through the casing, another potential leak. The test engine was actually leaking through the seal where the two halves of the engine are bolted together, but only about 1 psi of pressure was lost in a day or two. Hopefully the engine I have does not have any issues.
I don't think Infinia actually used any better than a neodymium magnet as there was a lot of concern about keeping the engine cooled below 70° C (about) So it really couldn't take any more heat internally than a coffee cup model LTD engine or the generator would have to be replaced.
Possibly a permanent .magnet type generator is not the best idea in conjunction with a heat engine. A regular car alternator can withstand higher temperatures than that, up to about 150°C but it doesn't do it any good. Higher than that and the insulation on the copper windings can melt.
Personally for a DIY project, sticking with a lower temperature type engine with everything down on the ground has it's advantages. Maybe something like the SunPulse.
This thing produces 500 watts and there is a larger version that puts out 1.5 kw
https://youtu.be/v_e0981CLDI
But I don't think they are being made any more.
And, you already have the dish.
Either way your dish should be big enough to produce at least 500 watts. Of course, that would depend on things like the quality of the reflective surface, and the capabilities of the engine.
The frame may need some reinforcement if it is going to have to hold an engine up in the air.
I don't think you would want to go smaller.
At this point, I'm still not sure the Infinia engine I have will operate, or if I'll be able to get useable power out of it.
I was reading something recently that their early test models had issues with leaking helium and required fairly regular refilling, but that was being tested in a vacuum chamber to simulate conditions in outer space.
But I also noticed some fraying of the electrical cord at the point where it passes through the casing, another potential leak. The test engine was actually leaking through the seal where the two halves of the engine are bolted together, but only about 1 psi of pressure was lost in a day or two. Hopefully the engine I have does not have any issues.
I don't think Infinia actually used any better than a neodymium magnet as there was a lot of concern about keeping the engine cooled below 70° C (about) So it really couldn't take any more heat internally than a coffee cup model LTD engine or the generator would have to be replaced.
Possibly a permanent .magnet type generator is not the best idea in conjunction with a heat engine. A regular car alternator can withstand higher temperatures than that, up to about 150°C but it doesn't do it any good. Higher than that and the insulation on the copper windings can melt.
Personally for a DIY project, sticking with a lower temperature type engine with everything down on the ground has it's advantages. Maybe something like the SunPulse.
This thing produces 500 watts and there is a larger version that puts out 1.5 kw
https://youtu.be/v_e0981CLDI
But I don't think they are being made any more.
And, you already have the dish.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
You can throw an awful lot of heat at these little old style engines without too many worries.
https://youtu.be/R_QB5amihko
All metal. No foam rubber to melt, no glass to crack or break. No heat sensitive magnets.
https://youtu.be/R_QB5amihko
All metal. No foam rubber to melt, no glass to crack or break. No heat sensitive magnets.
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
wow, this little engine is very cute.
how difficult do you think it would be to build something like this please? let's say difficulty from 1-10?
how difficult do you think it would be to build something like this please? let's say difficulty from 1-10?
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
I just put that together from a kit, that even included the tools, which is quite easy. Maybe a zero difficulty.
If someone needed to make one from scratch, let's say, a scaled up size, the difficulty increases and someone would need some sand casting and machining ability or resources, which, I may be able to do, but I'm not set up for it yet.
If you go to this chanel on YouTube he has a whole series of videos on making a nearly identical engine from scratch, castings and all.
https://youtu.be/mJxOvc5aJgI
Re: 0.5 Kw Stirling engine collaboration project
I'm also of the opinion that the engine body castings could actually be made of ceramic, and because of ceramic being non- heat conducting, this type of engine would actually be quite a bit more efficient and not require such a high heat input.
The displacer as well, I believe would be better if non-heat conductive.
Of course, the power cylinder at least, would need a metal sleeve.
I've also been thinking an engine of this sort could be longer lasting and more reliable by in some way incorporating NASA type flexure bearings, making it nearly if not completely frictionless.
Some of the mechanical linkages could be eliminated by making the displacer a Ringbom style, maybe even make the piston "free" and include a linear generator.
I kind of mostly, or at least sometimes, for practical reasons and cost, prefer having an actual crank and flywheel. Just because it can have rotational mechanical output, and attaching an off the shelf rotary generator or alternator with a chain or belt is much easier than building a linear generator from scratch, as, it does not seem like any are available.
The displacer as well, I believe would be better if non-heat conductive.
Of course, the power cylinder at least, would need a metal sleeve.
I've also been thinking an engine of this sort could be longer lasting and more reliable by in some way incorporating NASA type flexure bearings, making it nearly if not completely frictionless.
Some of the mechanical linkages could be eliminated by making the displacer a Ringbom style, maybe even make the piston "free" and include a linear generator.
I kind of mostly, or at least sometimes, for practical reasons and cost, prefer having an actual crank and flywheel. Just because it can have rotational mechanical output, and attaching an off the shelf rotary generator or alternator with a chain or belt is much easier than building a linear generator from scratch, as, it does not seem like any are available.